Author Topic: Is America still a Christian Country?  (Read 2140 times)

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Offline Tony

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Is America still a Christian Country?
« on: October 04, 2008, 09:00:47 PM »
I know a little about the Christian foundations of our country. I know that the First two presidents were Godly men. If you read some of Washington's writings they are quite amazing for their intelligence, passion and love of God. After Washington and Adams, it seems to have gone downhill a good deal. None of our presidents after Reagan would have a chance of getting elected in early America, and none of the early Christian presidents would have a chance of getting elected now. Nowadays we have politicians running for office not statesmen. (With the exception of maybe Chuck Baldwin & Alan Keyes, and a couple others of that mold, in my humble opinion.)

So I submit for your consideration: Is America still a Christian Country? And if not... Why do WE keep on voting for increasingly godless politicians from both parties?

Offline Tim Russ

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2008, 04:51:42 PM »
No.  America is no longer a Christian country.  We're living in a post-Christian America.

The other question was answered in the other post. ;)


Offline Ro

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2009, 09:19:10 PM »
What is the statistic, 51% to be considered 'the nation'.  We have many who say they believe in God.  However, even Satan believes in God so the real question is how many people have accepted Jesus as their Lord and Savior.  Lord means that we listen to him and obey.  That is the part that will separate the 'men from the boys'. 

However, I believe we can personally be a Christian person and have a Christian family.  That is what we indeed have control over.  If enough of us were to do that, then perhaps we could get back to being a "Christian Nation." 

Ro is a motivational speaker. She speaks at conferences, seminars, churches, Women's Ministries, or secular meetings.  Check out the site and book her for your event early to ensure her for your event.
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Offline Tim Russ

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2009, 04:26:38 PM »
Nations cannot be Christian.  Only people can be Christians.  To impose Christianity on a nation would be no better than imposing any other religious system upon the citizens of a nation. 

God's kingdom is in the hearts and minds of men and women.  It's not about forcing people to follow laws but to encourage them to follow The Spirit.


Offline Ro

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #4 on: April 03, 2009, 09:20:54 PM »
Good point.

It's the people who are Christian not the 'nation'.  But aren't the people the nation?  If there were no people here, would there be a nation?
 
 :5
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Offline Tim Russ

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2009, 12:06:33 PM »
Yes the people are what nations are made of.  However, there is no collective salvation for nations. :D

Offline Ro

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #6 on: April 04, 2009, 12:27:22 PM »
True, point taken.

Hey Tony is online too!
Cool!
Ro is a motivational speaker. She speaks at conferences, seminars, churches, Women's Ministries, or secular meetings.  Check out the site and book her for your event early to ensure her for your event.
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Offline Tim Russ

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #7 on: April 04, 2009, 12:30:00 PM »
Yeah and he's going to install a free bible program!  WooHoo!

http://www.wordsearchbible.com/be4.php


Offline Tony

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #8 on: April 04, 2009, 06:57:28 PM »
Tim, you seem to know what & when I'm doing it. Don't tell to much.   :2

And, for the sake of discussion, if Christians fled England to escape the Church of England
 (the state imposed religion), to find their 'own' country to be free to follow their Christian faith
(not a state imposed denomination), wouldn't that new country (at that time) be considered a
'Christian Nation?'

For instance, just as Saudi Arabia would be considered a 'Muslim Country,' even though there are some who don't practice the traditional Sunni approach to Islam, or the few thousand practicing Christians, Jews, Hindu, Buddhists, etc.

By a lot of the founders writings it appeared they considered this a Christian Country. (More on that, later.)

Offline Ro

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #9 on: April 04, 2009, 07:10:19 PM »
 ;D

Do you live next door to him?  :2

 :)
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Offline Tim Russ

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #10 on: April 04, 2009, 08:21:14 PM »
Tim, you seem to know what & when I'm doing it. Don't tell to much.   :2

And, for the sake of discussion, if Christians fled England to escape the Church of England
 (the state imposed religion), to find their 'own' country to be free to follow their Christian faith
(not a state imposed denomination), wouldn't that new country (at that time) be considered a
'Christian Nation?'

For instance, just as Saudi Arabia would be considered a 'Muslim Country,' even though there are some who don't practice the traditional Sunni approach to Islam, or the few thousand practicing Christians, Jews, Hindu, Buddhists, etc.

By a lot of the founders writings it appeared they considered this a Christian Country. (More on that, later.)


In the sense that today we put labels on things our modern concept would clearly identify nations by their primary religious affiliation.  However the bible never does this.  I could only find the phrase Jewish nation in one place in only the NIV.  I checked Strongs concordance and the reference is to a race of people not a religion.

(John 11:51-52 NIV)  He did not say this on his own, but as high priest that year he prophesied that Jesus would die for the Jewish nation, {52} and not only for that nation but also for the scattered children of God, to bring them together and make them one.

(John 11:51-52 NASB)  Now this he did not say on his own initiative; but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus was going to die for the nation, {52} and not for the nation only, but that He might also gather together into one the children of God who are scattered abroad.

(John 11:51-52 KJV)  And this spake he not of himself: but being high priest that year, he prophesied that Jesus should die for that nation; {52} And not for that nation only, but that also he should gather together in one the children of God that were scattered abroad.


51 And <G1161> this <G5124> spake he <G2036> not <G3756> of <G575> himself <G1438>: but <G235> being <G5607> high priest <G749> that <G1565> year <G1763>, he prophesied <G4395> that <G3754> Jesus <G2424> should <G3195> die <G599> for that <G5228> nation <G1484>;
52 And <G2532> not <G3756> for that <G5228> nation <G1484> only <G3440>, but <G235> that <G2443> also <G2532> he should gather together <G4863> in <G1519> one <G1520> the children <G5043> of God <G2316> that were scattered abroad <G1287>.
53 Then <G3767> from <G575> that <G1565> day <G2250> forth they took counsel together <G4823> for to <G2443> put <G615> <G0> him <G846> to death <G615>.

John 11:51-53 (KJV)

Strongs Concordance
1484. ethnos, eth'-nos; prob. from G1486; a race (as of the same habit), i.e. a tribe; spec. a foreign (non-Jewish) one (usually by impl. pagan):--Gentile, heathen, nation, people.

The real problem I have with attaching religious descriptors to nations is that in most cases these nations aren't theocracies.  We deal with them according to their political ideology and their laws.  Some nations have enacted sharia law ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharia ) and in those cases where their religion defines their political ideology and their law they must be dealt with according to those descriptors.

If 95% of the people in the US were Christians even if 99% of them were Christian we still couldn't refer to ourselves as a Christian nation.  It wouldn't be accurate.  I personally wouldn't be comfortable living in a nation that formed their laws with the idea of a religous ideology. 

Let's say I was a Charismatic/Pentecostal and the laws were based on Southern Baptist theology.  A goodly chunk of what I believe would be outlawed.  Ok, so if we form the laws in such a way that we embrace the lowest common denominator among those denominations that are considered Christian where do we stop?  You see the problem?


Offline Tony

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #11 on: April 04, 2009, 11:38:37 PM »
you guys are wearin' me out today. Heck, it's almost 'tommorow.' I'll get some sleep, study on this, and respond a bit later...ZZZZZZZZZ


Offline Tony

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #12 on: May 03, 2009, 02:11:08 AM »
Here is something I posted on a different topic earlier today under 'God showed me Christians' and realied it may shed some light on how I feel about this subject. I'm sure I will add more later:
    Re: God showed me Christians
« Reply #1 on: Yesterday at 05:40:36 PM » Quote Modify 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Socialism and Communism are kissing cousins. Both are Godless forms of Government in which Christianity is oppressed. Most Democracies are but a step away including ours.

Our Country was originally intended to be a Federal Republic. The problem is, this form of government depends on Godly people to operate as intended:

 "Our Constitution was made ONLY for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other."
John Adams

Our Founders also knew Democracies weren't the answer:

Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy that did not commit suicide."
John Adams

I'm not a Founding Father, but here is one of my quotes on democracy:

"Democracies, however well intentioned, are but mob rule.
Jesus said the majority of people were fools.
Why then, do wise men ponder over the decline in our Country's morals and it's leaders? History shows that Democracies always become corrupt and fail, or turn into Socialism."
Tony Eversgerd

I agree with you that there are Christians under many forms of government. However many are not conducive to the spreading of the Gospel, which is of the utmost concern. Although some progress can be made under an oppressive government thru martyrdom, it's not the idea way to spread the Gospel.

I realize God isn't an American but I do see His Hand in the forming and shaping of it. I would even go so far as to say I believe God wanted to use America to spread the Gospel, in some respects like a modern day Israel.
Unfortunately, we have kicked Him out of our schools and pretty much out of our Country.

 As Christians, although we are concerned with our own salvation and that of our family's, we should also be concerned about our friends, neighbors, schools and ultimately the Country. To help hold the banner of Christ high and to elect Christians to Public office is ultimately helping to promote a Country in which the spreading of the Gospel is conducive, not oppressive.

" No Free government exists in the world, except where Christianity is acknowledged, and is the religion of the country."
1824 Supreme Court of the United States

When you say 'Christians can 'thrive' under any form of government', I guess I would agree in principle. I could practice my faith alone with God and silently, but I would prefer to have a Bible, Christian friends & fellowship and the ability to publicly proclaim my faith. Many Christians throughout the world can't do that.

Proverbs 29:2 "When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice:
                      but when the wicked beareth rule, the people mourn.

Offline Ro

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2009, 05:56:37 PM »
Some people have a formula for determining if we are a Christian nation.  Not sure who actually wrote the formulas.  Some have said that if the leaders are Christian then we are a Christian nation.  Some have said that if 51% of the people in the country are Christians then we would be considered a Christian nation. 

When we get into determining if we are a Christian nation we run into all sorts of difficulties.  Who are the Christians?  Those who believe in God?  Or only those who believe in Jesus and that he is the only way to salvation?  Or perhaps those Christians who keep the same Sabbath day that Jesus did. 

There are a lot of questions when we become the judge.  The real issue and the important question is, are WE personally living our Christian values and beliefs?  We should be.  We should hold on to the beliefs that Jesus left us and promised to send the Holy Spirit to reveal to us and to comfort us. 

It really seems to me that too many Christians have compromised their beliefs, values and standards.  When we stand firm in what we believe is in the Bible, then we are true Christians.  We know what God wants and we do it.  That is holding fast to what we have been given. 

My personal belief is that too many Christians have compromised their values and standards because of sin around them and they have lost their witness to the world.  Interestingly our witness can often be the most powerful when it is our light shining and not our mouth moving. 

I heard a pastor tell a story a few years back that I would like to share.  He was working at a company that did daily deliveries. I don't recall the product that was being delivered.  This was before he was a Pastor full time.  This was a job he had prior to going to the mission fields.  He worked with a very difficult boss.  The boss and everyone in the company knew he was a Christian.  It was a small company and he was not ashamed of his beliefs.  However, this boss was as mean as possible to him because he was a Christian.  The pastor told how he was extremely frustrated because he was being singled out to do more work, longer routes, and later routes.  He was humiliated many times by this boss and he felt like doing the carnal thing but he just took it.  He was explaining how many times our minds are thinking of the carnal reaction and we just need to do what we know is right. 

Finally the day came for him to leave and go to the mission field.  He left for a year or more.  When he returned to the states he was having trouble finding another job so he decided to go back to the same company to see if they had any work.    When he got there a few people gave him a cheery Hello.  Then he saw the old boss.  The pastor wanted to leave because he did not want a confrontation.  The old boss said Hello, to him and invited him to come to his office.  The Pastor went with a bit of hesitation.  When they got to his office, the Pastor walked in and went to sit down in a chair across from the bosses desk, when he noticed something strange.  There on his desk was a Holy Bible.  He picked it up and he looked at the old boss.  The old boss looked at him and smiled and said, I got saved.  A few months after you left, I thought, you know, I treated him like dirt and he just took it, and took it, and took it....Maybe there is something to this Christianity stuff.  He went to a local church and began hearing the Word of God and accepted Jesus as his Lord and Savior.  Well, the Pastor was elated and they chatted a bit. 

When the pastor recounted that story to us, he said, BOY Was I glad I did not react to him how I had wanted to .... but rather I did what I knew Jesus wanted me to do.  His point was that we first need to do what is right....the attitude will come later.  It is the same with our Christian walk.  We need to do what we know is right.  That is our first line of witnessing.  That is our light. 

Praise God for being our Awesome God.
 
Ro is a motivational speaker. She speaks at conferences, seminars, churches, Women's Ministries, or secular meetings.  Check out the site and book her for your event early to ensure her for your event.
http://www.RoLashua.com

Offline Tony

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Re: Is America still a Christian Country?
« Reply #14 on: June 10, 2009, 09:38:20 PM »
I have a lot of great quotes from our Founders and many Presidents, etc. I won't share them at this time unless requested. I would like to provide a link and would encourage those interested in this subject to visit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dpQOCvthw-o